This week I would like to address the concept of reincarnation and its relevance to the Bible. Next we’ll look at scriptures that some use to support reincarnation, as well as scriptures that opponents use to refute it. Finally, I’ll explain what my personal beliefs are on this fascinating subject.
Growing up and attending traditional church services, I was never told about reincarnation; it certainly wasn’t up for discussion in Wednesday night Bible study. Of course, you can hardly blame religious leaders for leaving it out of their teachings when everything they have studied and read probably refuted the idea. But many people today—including some religious leaders—do not know that reincarnation was a common belief at the time of Christ. In fact, even the disciples of Jesus accepted it. John chapter nine makes this absolutely clear. In this incident, the disciples and Jesus pass a blind man on the side of the road. The disciples then asked Jesus if it was this man or his parents who sinned to make him be born blind. The question reveals what they believed, for how can a man come into this world blind because of sin if he had not lived a previous life to do the sinning?
For many years following Christ’s ministry, reincarnation was believed by many of the most influential Christians. Origen stated, “The soul has neither beginning nor end. [They] come into this world strengthened by the victories or weakened by the defeats for their previous lives.” Many centuries later, reincarnation was so widespread among Christians that the Roman emperor Justinian took action that led to its banishment in the mid sixth century AD. It is interesting that this was accomplished by a Roman emperor. At this time, the church was more of a state institution than an avenue of spirituality, and I imagine a belief in reincarnation probably wasn’t in the best interest of an emperor who demanded total obedience from his subjects; if the people were allowed to believe reincarnation was true, then eternal punishment really wouldn’t be the judgment for a soul who disregarded the divine orders of the Christian emperor.
Because of the efforts of Justinian and many others, it didn’t take long for this doctrine to be systematically removed from Christian theology. And as you probably already know, most Christians didn’t have access to the scriptures. In fact, at certain times in history, it wasn’t just reincarnation that was banned—READING THE BIBLE WAS TOO! So it REALLY shouldn’t surprise us that the idea of reincarnation didn’t survive the divine will of the emperor, and has only resurfaced in the last few centuries when more people are able to think critically about what the scriptures truly mean.
So where does the idea of reincarnation surface in the Bible? Actually, there are too many places for one blog post, so let’s go over the more popular ones used for reincarnation discussions.
One of the most well-known prophecies in the Old Testament is the return of Elijah. Prominent scriptures teach that Elijah must return to earth to prepare the way for the Lord. In fact, according to common Jewish belief, Elijah was to come and “restore all things” before any messiah could appear. So in order for Jesus to have been the messiah, this prophecy had to have come to fruition. And it seems that Jesus confirmed that it did.
In Matthew 11:14 Jesus tells the multitude of John the Baptist: “If you are willing to accept it, he [John] is Elijah who is to come.” Jesus also states in the Gospel of Mark: “But I tell you that Elijah has come, and they did to him whatever they pleased, as it is written of him.”
The phrase “…as it was written of him…” which is speaking of Elijah, makes this whole point pretty clear: Jesus was trying to convey that John the Baptist was of the same spirit as that of Elijah.
I think these scriptures are pretty clear about who John was. Nevertheless, and to be fair to the opponents of the idea of reincarnation being supported in the Bible, there do seem to be scriptures that refute it, at least on the surface. But upon close inspection, I do not think they are very strong. For instance, many Westerners—often ones that have not studied what reincarnation truly is or means—will combat the reincarnation of Elijah as John with Luke 1:17, which states that John will go before the messiah “…in the spirit and power of Elias [Elijah].” They conclude that “in the spirit and power of Elijah” means it wasn’t Elijah. This is probably one of the worst arguments an opponent could give. Why? Because returning to the earth in the “spirit and power” of someone who has already lived on the earth IS REINCARNATION! Actually, there isn’t really a much better definition for it. It would seem that the opponents of Biblical reincarnation haven’t thought this one through very well, and only someone who didn’t understand the concept of reincarnation would use this scripture as proof against it. The sad part is that there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of websites that do in fact use this argument.
Opponents of Biblical reincarnation also use John 1:21-23 as ammunition. Here, the Levites ask John the Baptist point blank if he is Elijah that was to come. John responds by telling them no. So If John really was the reincarnated Elijah, why would he deny it?
We could also ask why John didn’t know Jesus was the true messiah while in jail before being beheaded. In the beginning of his ministry, the gospels make it clear that John understood exactly who Jesus was. But after being put in jail, he went through a period of doubt where he wasn’t sure if Jesus really was THE messiah or not, so he sent his disciples to personally ask him. It seems John lost faith when he failed to comprehend the full extent of Jesus’ ministry. Couldn’t John have also made the mistake of not realizing he was the reincarnation of the spirit to be in Elijah before?
When I began to understand more of what reincarnation was, I realized that just because John didn’t believe he was Elijah reincarnated doesn’t mean much. Each reincarnated life is a culmination of previous lives and conscious experiences before it. Reincarnation is not about the exact same person coming back to inhabit a different body. It’s about many life experiences that one soul goes through in order to grow and hopefully mature. Each incarnation of the soul can therefore still be understood to b a unique individual person. And when that soul dies, that same soul doesn’t come back. Why? Because what reincarnates is that same soul in addition to the culminate experiences that soul has had in perpetuity. Let’s say that I, Joshua Tilghman, was to reincarnate on the earth two hundred years from now. Is it Joshua Tilghman that is reincarnating? Not exactly. However, some of the same personality traits that made up Joshua Tilghman would reincarnate.
We must also remember that the Old Testament states Elijah must come back to prepare the way of the messiah. So if you don’t believe Elijah returned in the spirit of John, how can you believe Jesus was the messiah?
Another scripture often used to refute reincarnation is Hebrews 9:27. It states “…it is appointed men once to die…”
But even this is within the confines of reincarnation. As we already discussed, after death it is not the exact same soul that returns. It is the culmination of all of that soul’s incarnations which results in a unique individual every incarnation cycle. So even in the doctrine of reincarnation, it is still appointed unto man once to die! As both nature and Jesus taught, through death always comes more physical life! The death of one tree or plant produces thousands of more lives. Reincarnation is really not much different.
So why does mainstream Christianity still vehemently deny reincarnation today? One of the most prominent reasons is because it contradicts the idea of a resurrection after death. However, this is where I believe the institutionalized church of antiquity also missed the point. The resurrection does not take place after death, as the literal interpretation supposes. The resurrection takes place while you LIVE, as a spiritual experience. As the Gospel of Philip, a Gnostic scripture, states:
“People who say they will first die and then arise are mistaken. If they do not first receive resurrection while they are alive, once they have died they will receive nothing.”
This scripture was written because the Gnostics of antiquity understood that the literalists did not fully comprehend the spiritual intent of the New Testament writings. Even Jesus told Nicodemus that you must be “born again”, which better translates as “born from above”. This being born from above is a spiritual birth that happens while one is yet alive in the physical. When you combine this with Jesus’ statement that the Kingdom of Heaven is within you, it all becomes very clear; becoming born from above IS a resurrection!
If we are honest with ourselves, even most children would find the idea of God putting back together a body after it has been decomposed by worms and bacteria a little far-fetched.
I would now like to share a little more about my personal beliefs on reincarnation. Consider the following scenario, as I have:
Imagine a baby dying and then appearing before God. Since we are judged by the deeds done on this earth, what crown would this baby be able to place at the feet of Jesus? In other words, what could the baby offer in return for reward? Not only would the baby be able to offer nothing, but what could the baby receive? Wouldn’t this be the ultimate example of something totally unjust and unfair? The baby would not have even had the chance of offering something to God.
Consider another scenario: how can a merciful God create a place of eternal punishment for a sinner, especially when that God KNEW before hand that the creation would end up there? If God really did this, is “merciful” the right word to describe Him?
After thinking for myself instead of believing what I have been told about the Bible, I can’t help but wonder how much institutionalized Christianity strayed from its spiritually humble beginnings. I am willing to bet a whole lot.
Finally, and as you probably already know, reincarnation works on the principle of karma. This is exactly the same thing as reaping what you sow! THAT is just. THAT is merciful. This is also truly in line with a loving Father who rains both on the just and unjust! So yes, I think the idea of reincarnation is a very logical belief, and personally, I am glad to see that Jesus supports it.
What do you think?
I like pizza too!
LOL! Eric, maybe you didn’t approve? I still enjoyed the comment.
I Was Mary Magdalene. Ask Pope Francis . He knows about me . The DaVinci code is true . This is not a joke. Look up my name, birth date etc. and I have AB negative blood. I even have 2 trees that look like the Da Vinci code V. And I use essential oils and do massage and reflexology and am in a 12 step program . My life is like a strange movie . Oh well . It is what it is .
No offense, but I would NEVER ask that black pope anything.
And the whole idea of reincarnation is forgotten memories. Perhaps during meditation and dreams, we can tap into our past lives. But I doubt you would be able to pinpoint who you were because you give massages.
WHAT IS WRONG WITH A BLACK POPE ? YOU SCARED ? YOU SHOULD BE.
Yes reincarnation is real, and believe it or not I am John the Baptist reincarnated. I was however not Elijah reincarnated as John the Baptist. When the prophet Elisha Elijah’s apostle was alive, I was General Naaman of the Assyrian army. Elijah was taken to one of the planets of the angels by a spaceship. He hasn’t died yet.
GOD BLESS YOU!
Rodney,
Thanks for commenting.
“Elijah was taken to one of the planets of the angels by a spaceship. He hasn’t died yet.”
Please visit http://bit.ly/Riod37 for an explanation.
God bless you too!
Thanks for commenting on the blog! I will check on that link you sent.
Ecclesiastes chapter 1 verse 9 is 100 percent proof of reincarnation, and was written by the wisest man to ever live, king Solomon. I’ll also check for more proofs my friend.
As always…GOD BLESS!!
I’ve always thought that Jesus of Nazareth had the wisest sayings of all time…..
just saying
Reincarnation for a few is possible but for every one. More so its is really being incarnated to another level or plane of existence rather then being born to this earth again, i do believe though that some have been reincarnated but not all have to go that route to learn from their experience
Thanks for your comment, erthonee. I do appreciate you reading. There are a lot of different beliefs even in the reincarnation camp, and although I am not sure exactly how reincarnation plays out for everyone, I do know it was taught by the earliest Christians.
The Spirit reincarnates in to a Human body, the Soul is in the Blood and gos into the grave until resurrection. i have been told by he Spirit of Truth, which is Christ in you a Hope of Glory, the Mystery Hidden from the Ages. Christ was the ROOT of David (not just his Father Jesse) But ET-YADAM (Paleo Hebrew 1100 BC) the first Son of God put on this World Luke 3:38, and the Offspring as CHRIST THE ANIONTED YAHWASUA, Silly Little Christian Rabbits, Always learning, but never coming to the understanding of the Truth, Wake-Up Lost Sheep and come into the Glorious Light of the Father and Son and Their Spirit, which is Very Holy, but not a Devil Doctrine of the Trinity.
Trinity. not in the bible
Here’s a statement from the Bible which presumes a belief in reincarnation:
Naked I came from my mother’s womb, and naked I shall return there. (Job 1:21)
This can best be understood by;
how can a man return to his mother’s womb if not through rebirth into another mother’s body?
Allen,
Great scripture! I find it hard to believe that anyone would try to argue this any other way; I have seen some try. Thanks for the comment.
Joshua – I’ve a question for U.
You stated the following in a June 16th post.
“There are a lot of different beliefs even in the reincarnation camp, and although I am not sure exactly how reincarnation plays out for everyone.”
=============================================
What do you mean by “not sure how reincarnation plays out for everyone?”
Why wouldn’t it be the same for everyone?
It seems to me that as spirits…WE ALL… ‘trillions and trillions of us’ are just at different stages of growth, maturity and progression.
All spirits may not have been created at the same time.
Also, our earth is a very backward, dense and tough world compared to other worlds in the universe. Very young spirits may never be allow to come to our earth in its present state.
It seems that some spirits that are younger and more ignorant and may be more inclined to do wickedness…while others that are older and more mature (wise) may have had a opportunity to be further along.
Your thoughts, Allen
=====================
One more Q…
As I was getting ready to send this post to you I noticed something.
How did a post at my site get to the bottom of your page?
the post is titled:
“”Earth…at it’s creation…was resting station for wandering spirits”
I am glad to see it there…just surprised that’s all.
Allen,
Your post was added to the bottom of your comment because of a plugin called “Commentluv.” This is one of the few plugins I thought would be worth its weight in gold. It rewards comments from others with sites and blogs by allowing links back to your site. The plugin does this automatically and hopefully will help get your word out too since people can easily visit your site from mine now. The plugin also does the same for me. I am still learning how valuable this plugin is. I just purchased it.
About your question on reincarnation:
My word choice was poor. What I should have said is that I didn’t want to get into the semantics of how reincarnation plays out for everyone in the post. As you stated, everyone is different as regards to their maturity, so the next cycle is determined by the choices and experiences from the previous one. Thanks for getting clarification, and I look forward to hearing more of your thoughts with future posts on reincarnation. It’s an important topic!
were have you seen any body walk on water ?
In “The Revelations Of An Elite Family Insider 2005” it is said that reincarnation is true. The person posting all the answers also says that Earth is a prison, “and even worse”, and from what I took from reading the document is that once we have proven ourselves to be worthy, we will eventually be released from this prison and return to the One. This document also says that the struggles in our lives is not with the outside world, but within ourselves. I find it a very interesting document, it opened up my eyes. Any chance it will be covered in an article on this site?
I can easily see why someone could say the earth is a prison. I could also see why someone could say this earth is a paradise. Why? Because as you stated, the struggle truly is “within” ourselves. This is why Jesus was crucified at Golgotha, the “place of the skull.” Esoterically this means that Jesus overcame his mind, his ego. The battle is between the ears. That’s why we aren’t to walk by sight.
I will take a look at the article you mentioned. I don’t think I have ever seen or heard of it before.
We live in this Body of Death, in the Valley of the Shadow of Death, EARTH
I have been troubled by this matter my entire life. If God is just how could he let souls burn for eternity? How does that work? Are there different hells? Coz i find all this hard to believe! How can the soul of a man who cheated on his wife and the soul of a nazi who burnt and killed thousand of people burn together as if they had comitted the same sins. And that makes me question free will. If God knows our destiny, if our stories are written befOre hand then how are we free? I liked what Imran Ivanov had to say on reincarnation it made some sense to me. Oh and i just read your bio Josh and i have to say u sound alot like me. Are u a water sign? I read alot on astrology matter of fact im interested in anything that has to do with mystic and spiritualism im very curious about the greater purpose and that kinda stuff.
The Word of God is, Quick and Powerful, Sharper than a Two-Edged-Sword, Piercing even to the DIVIDING OF THE of Soul and Spirit, and of Joints and Marrow, and is a Discerner of the Thoughts and Intents of the Heart Hebrews 4:12. The Soul stays in the Grave until Resurrection, You Spirit goes back to God YAHWAH, who gave it, and is Reincarnated, your Spirit is and always has been Eternal.
woow.. I have never read this before “The Soul stays in the Grave until Resurrection, You Spirit goes back to God YAHWAH….” where did you find this? please do tell me as I want to read more about this , you have given me hope
Hi Joshua. You’ve hit the nail right on the head when you say that the doctrine of reincarnation was not compatible with the notion of eternal damnation, used by temporal powers to control people.
Jeronimus,
If only more people studied history, right? Thanks for commenting.
There have been 7 Ages before 6000 year ago (Where the Word of God are Pure Words, As silver in a furnace of the earth, Purified 7 times Pslams 12:6), when the First Son of God was put on this World, in ET-ADAM, a White man (like a NAZARITE=WHITE AS SNOW AND MILK, LAMATATIONS 4:7). There were many Trees in the Garden, of People, Nations and Races) This is the completion Age. It was not only an Apple that Eve eat, Cain was of the Wicked one 1 John 3:12. Gen 3:15 “And I will put enmity between thee (Serpent, Satan, Dragon and Devil) Seed and Her (EVE THE WOMEN) Seed; it (CHRIST) shall bruise thy Head, an thou (SERPENT) shall bruise His (CHRIST) heel. Of the many Genealogy’s in the Bible, Not one includes
Cain in the line of ADAM to CHRIST. The Flood happened around 4300 years ago, an Area that covered almost 2 Million Square Miles, Eygpt, India and China have histories that go back much longer. TRUTH HAS BEEN HIDDEN FROM US, BY THE GOD OF THIS WORLD.
Kenneth!! Can you point me in the right direction where you got this information..this si fascinating !!!! Thanks
Love to read more on this
Can blacks go to heaven? I must know!
Hi all,
I’m rather late to this thread but the topic interests. As a Latter-day Saint Christian (mormon) I’ve heard a quote that I’ve never seen (meaning hearsay) of Joseph Smith saying “Reincarnation is not a true doctrine as the world teaches it.”
Of course that would open the possibility that there is a true doctrine of reincarnation.
I’ve sometimes speculated on what that doctrine could be. Yours is a thoughtful article.
Regardless, LDS do not see hell as something the typical person will be in forever. The New Testament book of Revelations has hell delivering up the dead, along with the sea, the grave, and death. We believe after hell comes a reward and a glory to match the best that God can justify giving – and not a bit more or less. And that such a reward and glory will vary from person to person.
We also believe children under the age of 8 and all – whether Christian, athiest, or anything else – who are “honorable” (by God’s standards) will at the very least not have to go to hell and at best be able to receive every blessing if they would have accepted the good news of Christ with all their hearts if they had received the opportunity. I’m thinking that most people – probably even most “Christians” – have not received the opportunity because the good news is not generally correctly stated or understood.
Ultimately, I suspect past reincarnation (prior to birth on this planet) is far more likely than future reincarnation.
Hi Nathan,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us. Every perspective adds the debate, and all should be considered. Blessings.
Hi Joshua,
I enjoy a lot of the material you have put out! Its been refreshing to see someone else that believes the Word of God is all spiritual. Rom.(7:14), 1Cor.(10:3-4), Col.(1:9) Nevertheless I perceive faith turns up missing in a lot of what you have written! The information you put out about baptism was enlightening until you gave people exercises for meditation on the Word! Yes it’s true the kingdom of God is within you! Luke(17:21), Ecc.(3:11) No one can tap into the kingdom without an invitation! Concerning the Word I meditate also, but not by my will, power or strength. Only by the spirit guiding me into meditation, this is when I know its giving understanding of what I read! We have been taught we have free will! According to the Word that’s not true! Rom.(9:11-23), Phl.(2:13), Zec.(4:6) This spiritual journey is by faith and faith only! Knowledge isn’t enough! Matt.(18:20) Heb.(4:2) Faith which is Christ will bring us into the knowledge, otherwise we will become religious! I think we veer off because we make the scriptures about us, according to the Word it’s about Christ! Psa(40:7), Luke(24:44), John(5:39) I do love your zeal, compassion & love for the Word! Spirit & truth is the path! I look forward to breaking bread with you in the future! God Bless! A couple of scriptures that have helped guide me to understanding! Isa.(55:11) & John(3:27)
Moran,
In other articles I have written about faith and knowledge. Knowledge can never give you access to God. Gnosis, knowing, is about a direct experience and has more to do with faith than knowledge. Knowledge concerning the intellect is important because it can helps lead us to what God is NOT, but as you suggest it is only by faith and direct experience that we have access to what we label God. In other words, knowledge can bring you to the door of God, but knowledge can get you into that door. I hope this makes sense.
Blessings!
Hi Morgan…..
My thoughts are parallel to yours. All of Scripture is about Jesus Christ and His plan for worldwide salvation. We can’t see all the verses as literal stories.
One thought I had when reading this comment is that when Jesus told us that the “kingdom of God is within you”, He was telling us that our journey does not concern anyone else except changes within ourselves. It is a spiritual journey for each of us. As we read the bible and meditate upon God’s words, we will be led by the spirit of God in our understanding. That’s what’s meant in I John 2:27.
Another thought I had about reincarnation is that it detracts from the work of Jesus Christ. I John 2:2 tells us the He, alone, is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and also for the sins of the world. If we have to work out our own sins in the cycle of reincarnation, then the sacrifice Jesus made would be moot.
I am one of the few “our there” who does not believe in eternal torment in hell for anyone. The definition of God in I John 4:8 is “Love”. And He told us to “love our enemies”, so would He do less than we would do? In Jeremiah 32:35 God calls burning people to Molech “an abomination” and that this kind of thing never came to His mind. So, because of who God is, I cannot believe that he could, or would, condemn anyone for eternity.
Because some people, and maybe most of them, will have their “part” in the lake of fire. And I believe this is God’s way of purification, as God is also defined as a “consuming fire” in Hebrews 12:29. Facing God will be purification of sins not paid by the sacrifice of Jesus.
I just had to tell you that it is wonderful to read the thoughts of someone else who thinks spiritually, as I do. And, like you, I love the zeal and bible knowledge at this website.
God bless all….
Arlene
Hi Arlene,
It’s reassuring to know that the Spirit of truth is moving in the vessels in which God has chosen to reveal His son! I don’t expect everyone to agree with the understanding God has given to me because we all are in different stages of spiritual growth! You may be able to receive truth that I can’t because your faith is more mature than mine! That’s why Christ would say to the disciples that they weren’t able to bear certain truths! We all have been indoctrinated into the teaching of the law of Moses! Many have been called and few have been chosen to be awakened out of the sleep of that teaching! Why? Because that teaching is mans wisdom! And we have been awakened because of the mercy and compassion of God not because of anything we have done! Sorry the Word never gives man credit for doing the will of God as it shouldn’t because we have done nothing but live in this world and die! God has done it all for us! Four things God has shown me that allowed me to see how powerless we are as far as the spirit kingdoms! We don’t know when we will be born or die! And we can’t take out a bad spirit and put a good spirit in ourselves or anyone for that matter and vice versa! And as soon as we embrace our weaknesses instead of cover them up, only then can we see the one and only true God Jesus Christ! Resist mans teaching of God! Instead seek after the spiritual teaching of God which comes from within! The law of Christ has fulfilled the law of Moses!
I have been Circumcised in the Heart WITHOUT HANDS Colossians 2:10,11 and Romans 2:29, what an Amazing Feeling it is, Christ cutting away the Body of Sins in the Flesh and God writting His Laws upon your Heart and you become COMPLETE IN CHRIST. The Spirit never Dies, but the Soul that Sinneth Does.
Good Article! 2 good books on this subject – Journey / Destiney of souls, by michael newton
Happy New Year
Yes a very interesting article. I have been firmly convicted in my belief in reincarnation. Without reincarnation karma does not make much sense as everybody knows people often get away with terrible things. It can only make sense if we are to undergo reincarnation and be born in possibly less favourable conditions perhaps even in a lower plane of existence. Another thought I have about this is that before we reincarnate we may have to experience our karma in an afterlife astral plane of existence. In this way some may even experience a temporary ‘hell’ in an astral plane. I find this thought a little bit frightening because who knows how long this hellish duration would be and how can we be sure if our positive karma outweighs our negative karma. I suffer from depression and often feel very unfulfilled in life. So I worry that if I was to go to the grave still feeling like this would I experience a hellish afterlife ? The question really is do you need to be happy to have a good afterlife experience immediately after this one? Also in regards to the spiritual resurrection how does one know if that has taken place in oneself or not ?
Stevie,
Some ancient esoteric schools taught that anyone who didn’t experience what was to come in the afterlife in this life would experience some sort of suffering. But this isn’t to scare us. Suffering is a part of the human condition. Waking up from the illusion and ending desire is the way to experience the resurrection, but for most of us, this isn’t something that happens in one lifetime. It takes many. I suggest practicing meditation…daily. This will help. Also read Eckart Tolle’s the Power of Now for great pointers that can help you refocus on being content now. Don’t fret about how to know when you’ve had a resurrection experience. This will only get you sidetracked.
Joshua: have you read the work of Dr. Brian Weiss? Thoughts?
Luigi,
I have not read Dr. Brian Weiss’s direct works yet. But your question promoted me to do some research, and I looked into his experience with Oprah. As a psychotherapist, he seems to have some great ideas into past life trauma and how it has had an affect. I will look into him further.
Very interesting- thank you. You mention the Roman emperor Justinian as being the one who deleted all references to reincarnation in the Bible. But I’ve read it was the emperor Constantinople (who was the 1st Roman emperor to turn to Christianity in around 530 AD) that ordered all references out of the Bible and enforced all talk or mention of reincarnation. Is the Justinian and Constantinople eras linked?
The notion that prior to Justinian or Constantine there were any references (either positive or negative) to reincarnation in the Bible is pure myth. There now exist many manuscripts of both Old and New Testaments from before both emperors, and not one of them even mention the idea, nor are there any references to it that are “missing” from the later copies of the Bible. All the available hard evidence disproves this conspiracy theory.
To give a modern example, it would be like claiming that there were UFOs in the original of Hamlet, but “they” removed it in the 19th century. About the same dates, about the same sort of evidence.
It is an easy, but sloppy, expedient, to claim that if a thing is not in the Bible presently, it must have been removed by someone. This is Dan Brown’s mistake, who claimed that there was no reference to the deity of Christ in the church before Nicea; Brown is an exciting novelist, but a poor historian.
I was surprised to discover not long ago that reincarnation has always been a part of Jewish tradition, though not all Jews accept it.
There were even rabbis who specialised in identifying a person’s past lives, presumably to help them understand the present life better. Not sure if this practice continues today.
Personally I feel its best to concentrate on the present life, but I can see that sometimes knowledge of past existences could be therapeutic.
This is personal, but I don’t believe in reincarnation. Sure, it’s persuading and cool and all, but what about normal people? You don’t hear them being reborn, do you? I’m a Southern Baptist, and for me it’s hard to believe that people know they’ve been “reincarnated”. Even if we were, how would we know? Yes, I’m aware some of you guys believe it or part of it (no offense in any way), but I mean, seriously. We all are “born again” (John 3:3-8) in Christ, but not in another body (again, my opinion.).
I’m just saying that if Nicodemus (you know who he is, asked Jesus a few questions in John 3) said we can’t be reborn into new flesh, and JESUS SAID IT TOO, why would it make sense?
-Zoey
The word “reincarnation” is a stumbling block, even though the principal is of a high intellect. It’s that worldly concept of having lived again, maybe even as a rat. And because of that sort of abuse in understanding, this is a concept that most Christians will resist. It is an esoteric concept. The truth involved simply cannot be heard, for the construct of religion is flowing on a totally different channel. But I do understand your desire and right to state your heart on your blog. That is your forum.
I, also, embrace the concept that we have been here before, especially because it doesn’t seem logical or practical that God would accomplish something in a space of a body and not continue it on in His own mechanism. After all, there is only 1 Spirit–God’s, and it is He who has the soul (the 1 corporate soul), and we provide the bodies. Therefore, God is recomposing or recycling an essence of his own soul and life that will serve a continued purpose in the new version of today, the eternal NOW. Future, past & present are all contained there. I do not believe this diminishes our own persona that he is building up. But that small bump, hill, or mountain that He is working on to press us into the Kingdom (pressure, tribulation) is indeed Him with my name on it, for the purpose I fill today.
Blessings to you!
For me reincarnation if I believed in reincarnation would be just that a belief – since unless one experiences or remembers being reincarnated one can only assume they have been reincarnated based on the beliefs of reincarnation. I have no memory of being reincarnated. The evidence that you pose makes sense and is believable based on the evidence however for me evidence would be me experiencing It.
God can Raise any part of His Creation, at any time He so desires.
Ken,
We must take it upon ourselves to be raised. All of our choices affect the spirit, soul, and body.
Joshua God YAHWAH does it all, He does the Drawing, Calling, Choosing, Electing, Predestinating, Justifying, Sanctifying, Glorifying and Conforming us to the Image of the Son, He did this before the foundations of the World (when He Foreknew us and wrote Our names in the Book of Life) when the LAMB WAS SLAIN. We have no choice in any of this.
Hi Josh,
I have recently become interested in the tradition of reincarnation in the Christian tradition.
I keep hearing about many early Christians believing it, Justinian squashing it and many verses being taken out that reference it.
However, I really only find people saying these things and not citing historical references. There seems to be one guy that wrote a book in the 1900’s that a lot of people quote, but as far as I can tell, he has not real sources either. Also Origen, but he is also quoted as denying it.
I’m certainly not looking to challenge you or the idea reincarnation, because it certainly would answer a lot of questions. I have just yet to come across much reliable evidence that it ever had a place in Christianity (historically speaking). Is there a book/reference you recommend that speaks to the belief of this within the church?
BlessedT,
It is true, its hard to find any direct quotes that proves without a doubt he believed in reincarnation. But I believe its there, you just have to read quite a bit of his writing to understand. Origen studied Christian and Platonic thought, and often combined the two teachings. He firmly believed that all would be returned back to God at the end, and reincarnation plays a part in this belief system.
I understand reincarnation in a spiritual level too.
Each moment a new mind or state of mind arise is a reincarnation and it depends in your past actions or karma.
When you access the Kingdom of God within you (enlightenment) this cycle is over, you don’t depends any more on past actions, and your mind is full of light
Thanks for the article. This thinking is closely aligned with reincarnation as written in A Course in Miracles which I have studied for while now. Your writings reinforce all writings in ACIM.
Time and, therefore, space are illusory -not any different from a dream. God doesn’t have any influence on what happens in this world except through the holy spirit if we choose to listen. We are all having an impossible dream that we are separate from Him, it is an impossible dream because it is untrue. God wouldn’t create a world that His son would suffer, get sick and die in. How could a perfect entity create such a hot mess?
Nevertheless, He patiently awaits our return to Him which is an inevitabity. The time it takes us to return to unity with our Father is up to us by learning spiritual ‘lessons’ in each lifetime that are based on total forgiveness of our illusions. Time (our illusion) is only useful in facilitating learning. Time will stop (the end of our reincarnation cycle) when it is no longer useful in facilitating learing.
Thanks Joshua! Keeping writing, my brother…
I will first state that I believe in reincarnation, but my basis is not written and translated and re-written words from over 2000 years ago. My basis is my current work in the 21st century where I condition people to be able to channel spirits today. These spirits provide extremely constant and consistent information about how the universe works and a great deal of it is NOT what is recorded in the bible. I suppose so many people use the bible because it’s all they have. People say the bible is true and it is the word of God because that’s what the bible says. They use the bible as the basis to prove the bible. Well, isn’t that cute.
So many people are, in fact, just like sheep. They do not want to think for themselves. They just want someone else to tell them what to do and to think and to believe. And if that is their free will, then I suppose they get just what they are looking for. But I will conclude with this. There is a way to tap into actual spirit and get the actual truth about how all this works. But you will not find it watching football on the couch.
Lee. the Bible is not meant to be interpreted literally. It is my belief that it is an accurate representation of reality, both physical and spiritual, but it takes a little bit to study to learn how to interpret it.
Thank you for writing this article. I haven’t read through all of the comments but being a Christian who was fascinated by reincarnation as a teenager, I read many years ago that, yes, Emperor Justinian removed parts of the Bible.
I still regard reincarnation to be the most believable answer to what happens to the soul when one dies. However, has anyone ever been able to locate the text that was removed from the Bible?
Thanks.
Barbara,
It is the most believable, isn’t it? It took me until my early thirties to admit this.
It was more of the idea that was removed from Orthodox Christianity. By Justinian’s time, the epistles and books considered inspired were already locked in.
In Biblical times, the transmigration of the soul was such an accepted belief about life that they didn’t even address it very much, but there still are very clear references.
You are being deceived, man. This is a whole lot of nonsense and not biblical. Reincarnation is a heresy, and a false teaching. The Bible is clear in what it says. You are born, you are given a choice to accept Christ and follow him or deny and rebel, and then you die to stand before God. From there you will either enter eternal life or hell. There is no special “enlightenment” or wisdom that you acquire from being Mike Jones in one life on earth and John Smith in another life on earth that makes you “worthy” of entering Heaven. Don’t you know the Bible says that NO ONE actually deserves eternal life? You can’t earn it through works, only through faith, and you only get one chance. The Bible isn’t sending some encrypted message when it says “it is appointed unto men to die once”. It literally means we die once. What a bunch of foolishness. I’m sorry you are being led astray like this, I cannot only pray that you will return to the Bible for your wisdom and not your own understanding.
CJ., I implore you to dig deeper. The traditional interpretation of a literal heaven and hell for eternity is absurd. It violates so many basic psychological understandings about the ego, mind, and emotions. I’ve been where you have been as far as beliefs go. I believe there will be experiences in your life, whether now or much later, which will deeply challenge your beliefs. Instead of doubling down in dogma and doctrine, let you natural-born intuition and inclinations allow you to question and explore further. There is not judgment here. Blessings.
The whole scripture in Hebrews 9:27 is “And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:,,,,” This does not mean that men die only ONCE and that’s it. We have to grow and mature in wisdom and experience, and this cannot be done in just one lifetime.
We could live a thousand lifetimes, and at the end of EACH ONE, we will die, and then we will be judged for THAT ONE LIFETIME. All our “Karmic debts” must be paid by each of us before moving on to higher levels of spirituality. Then, according to Revelation chapter 3 verse 12, we will have no need to “go out any more” for maturity and karmic needs.
One lifetime is very short, and that short time should not be a “judgement” for eternal rewards or corrective punishment. What and who we will eventually be will be determined how we grow in wisdom and maturity through all kinds of life’s situations.
Each life is learning, and is very necessary fir each of us, “as our work will be” in the future Kingdom…..See Revelation 22:12.
Arlene…
Exactly!
We must be crucified with Christ in the life we live today. Once “crucified” with Christ, we die the death, and then we are with him in paradise, just like the thief on the cross. During our “death” Christ reigns in his kingdom, which is in us. Sin is utterly destroyed in us during this time because he died for our sins. We are crucified with him, but sin still dwells in our members. Our obedience leads to righteousness, but our obedience does not make us righteous, because our righteousness is as filthy rags, but we nonetheless must be obedient. Jesus Christ comes again, as he said he would, but this time it is not to deal with sin, but to bring salvation, so we must at all times be obedient, because we do not know when that day will be. Scripture says today is the day of salvation and that we take up our cross daily. We must always have our lamps full of oil for the day the bridegroom comes. The five foolish virgins were not prepared. In other words, be ready at all times for our salvation is nearer than we think. The death spoken of in scripture is not our natural bodies dying, but it is the death of the old man, the man of sin. It is during this time that all things are being made new. Jesus is raised from the dead before we are, but we will one day be resurrected from the dead too. When he comes again to bring salvation, we will at that point be alive forevermore, no more death, meaning death and sin are no more and we will be like him. He defeated death in us and for us because he defeated the sin in us, for the wages of sin is death but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord. The salvation he brings to us is how we have eternal life. It is by him and through him only.
Agree, yes! But for the sake of readers we have to remember what is stated in Luke 17:21:
“Neither shall they say, Lo here! or lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.”
In other words, the return of Christ, esoterically, is a completely “within” event. Everything stated above is an “internal” or conscious event. Just wanted to add 🙂
I don’t see anywhere in scripture where we are given another chance through reincarnation to get it right, though. It is not us who “gets it right.” It is by the work he does in us and through us that makes us holy. We can never and will never be able to become holy, even if we were given a thousand natural lives to do it in. The only reincarnation, if you want to call it that, that I see in scripture is being born again, but that is a spiritual birth, not another natural birth. And what is born spirit is spirit. The natural man comes first, then the spirit man. There is no scripture that says the spirit man than becomes a natural man again.
Karen…
I understand. You have to believe what you feel comfortable with. Many years ago I did not accept it either, and I felt it was a silly idea. But the more I learned about other scriptural themes the more I felt I had to get to the bottom of reincarnation. When I put down my former bias, it began to make sense.
For example, we know that Adam in the Garden did not have a physical body before the fall. It states that God gave them coats of skin (flesh), after the fall and their eyes were opened. Our traditional Christian backgrounds cover up the deeper meanings of what’s happening here.
When I began studying more about what the mind truly is, how it works, what the soul is, etc., intuitively the idea of reincarnation began to be grasped. This was a long process. And if God’s mercy is truly eternal, well then, you can see the problem right there of some of what mainstream religion has taught us.
But again, everyone believes what they desire based on their current understanding. If you are truly interested in the subject, keep seeking it out, and the process will eventually reinforce your current beliefs or change them. Just be sure to drop all bias, for only then can we arrive at deeper truths.
Blessings!
You believe scripture has spiritual meaning and that it is alleghory, but then you take the coats of skin and make it literal/natural.
If you read all scripture that has the word “skin” and all scriptures that has the word “coat,” it is clear that coats of skin is the works we do in our flesh, hence the reason we, (as Adam/man) are sent forth from the garden of Eden after our disobedience/sin to till the ground.
I use the KJV of the Bible and I use the software Bible Gateway to do my word searches. To search the word “skin” and the word “coat” and read all the scriptures with those words takes about 15 minutes total time. I think it would do good for you to do those searches and read the scriptures. Our physical natural eyes are not able to see spiritual things because they are unseen.
Karen…
I can assure that I am very aware of researching in that manner. Even Strong’s concordance can never give you the full understanding of the context in which the original writers of the Hebrew meant. The Hebrew term for “skin” does not just mean physical flesh. When I use the term flesh, I am speaking to the physical, emotional, and mental nature (the lower nature of man combined), similar to the terms “ground, world, and dust,” for man’s soul as understand by the ancients was multifaceted, combing sensations, emotions, and thoughts of the lower mind. For example, the reason Cain’s sacrifice was unacceptable by God was not because he literally brought the vegetables he grew from the ground, but that his sacrifice was from the lower nature, which is at enmity with God.
Let me give you another example which should make clear to you what I am speaking of. On the first “day” of creation it speaks about a “morning” and an “evening” being the first “day.” This would be a literal absurdity, because what we understand in English to mean a morning, an evening, and one day is based on the Earth’s spinning on it’s axis and the Sun’s sunlight. The stars (including the sun) wasn’t created until the fourth day. None of those terms used by the original writers of Hebrew meant anything close to what we understand as morning, evening, and day to us today.
Using Bible websites and software such as Gateway, E-sword, and Blue Letter Bible (with Strong’s) can be very useful in determining “surface” meanings, collaborating context between verses, finding how many times certain words are used in different books of the Bible, etc., but I can assure you that even these tools will never give you a truly accurate representation of the “spiritual” meanings. The ancient writers wrote in symbolism, dark sayings, and parables (Psalm 78:2). Have most people even taken the time to understand what a “dark saying” is? Most people do not.
I am not trying to convince you of anything, because I will make MANY mistakes myself in my interpretations. To fully understand the culture, thought, and context in which these writers of the Bible lived when they were writing was very different than today, and even their words, written in a multi-faceted language very much different than English and how those words carry meaning, is a hard thing to truly understand.
In saying that, I respect your opinions. But I also encourage you to go way beyond a 15-minute search using Bible software, religious commentary, etc.
I’ve done years of deep study with prayers for understanding of the things I did or do not yet understand. My earlier comment was said to say coats of skin have nothing to do with reincarnation.
Karen, correct, it doesn’t have anything directly to do with reincarnation. But understanding the ancient concept of man’s soul, it’s aspects, and how it functions and grows can help bring additional insight into why reincarnation could be true. For me it was crucial for putting many Biblical concepts together, and helping me form my opinions. At any rate, thank you for the discussion. I enjoyed it. And I wish you the best in your studies, wherever they lead 🙂
I’m so pleased to see this thread still active. I’ve come across it exactly 4 years to the day that you published it, 464.
I’d like to share my personal experience of receiving salvation, which is something I do not do often because it conflicts with established religious ideas in the Christian world.
I grew up believing in reincarnation. As far as I was concerned it was simply fact. I was troubled though by the closed loop of karmic action… in my child’s mind I thought, “you hit me, I feel hurt, you deserve to be hit back, I hit you back, then I deserve to be hit again.” What could possibly be the thing that breaks this cycle and gives liberation from karmic DEPT?
I also came to understand that reincarnation functions as the accumulation of karmic dept, that as a matter of law (almost Neutonian) has to be fulfilled and keeps the spirit captive to its closed loop. We are literally bound to return to try again to pay this never paid in full dept.
In my teen years I came to the understanding that one way out of that loop is to only Respond and not React, thereby liberating oneself from any particular karmic loop. This served me well for many years until real adult tribulations came into play and emotional selfishness reigned me in.
This is the impossibility of ultimately freeing oneself; the flowers of past karmic seeds are always blooming fresh, seeds we had no way of knowing were there and they can be very poisonous.
Finally, I was at a terrible terrible low point in my early 30s. I was listening to a Christian sermon on the radio. The pastor said something that made me stop short and was a revelation to me in what Christ was offering. In an instant I could see that Christ’s atoning death was a karmic dept paid in full on my behalf, and anyone who could humble themselves to accept it.
I was quite shocked and moved by the magnitude of a totally spotless and innocent incarnation of God taking full responsibility for MY transgressions. He has given us an out to reincarnation and the back and forth between pain, pleasure, suffering and death. He has provided a fail safe for our return to grace. It is an act of a love that is divine in its selflessness.
Soon thereafter I came to understand the nature of original sin and it’s relationship to karmic dept and therefore I was able to ask for my karmic dept/sins/actions to be forgiven. It’s not an exaggeration to say that it was immediately given and I felt life restored to me. I think this is how I was resurrected in Christ’s Love.
Nothing has looked or felt the same since. This was being born into life with Him. I’m far from perfect… nobody is perfect except Him and that is exactly the point. We are flawed, hopelessly bound to sin/dept, but He provides the way out, the salvation from that death masquerading as life. It is forgiveness, if only we can accept it.
Thank you for hearing my testimony, it has helped me to share it.
In Love,
Christina
Christina,
Thanks for sharing your personal story. I have come to a slightly different conclusion about salvation, but I believe their is some truth in the traditional Christian belief in forgiveness of sins. Thanks again for commenting, Christina!
What a beautiful testimony, Christina. Thank you for sharing. Glory to the name of the Lord!
Dear Joshua:
I had never seen this website and I came across it for the first time doing some research about reincarnation; your writings seem very sincere and I appreciate the way you exchange information with the people who read your article on the subject. I have other matters that I need to engage in so at the moment I do not have time to look through your entire website; so I just want to ask something for now: Are you a Christian of some sort or are you a “spiritual” person in the modern sense? The reason I ask is because I do have some things to share regarding other seemingly misguiding “teachings” of the Bible, but I do not want to offend anybody; it seems to me that you do look deeper than the average person, so I thought perhaps you would be interested in exploring other aspects of the Bible that are EXTREMELY contradictory to commonly accepted interpretations. If this type of discussion would be better held privately just respond to my personal e-mail. Thanks and blessings to you!
Rick
Rick, no offense ever taken. This website is intended for open discussion, no matter what your views. I certainly do not believe I understand the Bible completely. My interpretations are from the experiences I have had.
I am not a traditional Christian. I believe the Bible is an allegory meant to teach us about the nature of man. I would align myself more as a gnostic Christian, but even then there are many different beliefs about the Gnostics because there were many different sects. I do not align myself with any of them although I have come to appreciate the Valentian view quite a bit.
Hello Joshua,
I’ve read your article with great interest and not only conviced, but truly know reincarnation is one of life’s principals Jesus taught to all people.
The Bible is still a wonderful book with many guidelines and teachings and can be a great help in our achievements to have a pure Soul.
Therefore one of the most merciful comments written in the Bible is the fact that even we make mistakes over and over, we have a second, a third, even seven times seventy times a change given to choose something else. In fact it’s about never ending foregiveness and isn’t that the most merciful Gift 🙂
Forgiving is a way of let go ; truly leave behind and look at another way to situations and make a new choice.
In that perspective having a new change over and over, implies we have the Time and may use as many lives as we need to grow.
The Bible however has been translated over and over and even has been forbidden to be read in the first centuries after Jesus has lived.
In that perspective it is very likely words have been interpreted wrongly by the translators and even have been altered.
Reincarnation even was a threat for the rulers of the Church as everyone was given a second change because of reincarnation.
Therefore the community was told we only live once and one should obey the rules , otherwise it’s a one way ticket to hell. Rich people could buy a ticket for Heaven while others lived in fear of their judgement day after their death.
But Jesus has learned us we could see the real truth; as he has said: Those who have Eyes, they See and those who have Ears, they Hear.
Here he gave us a powerful help in looking at things in another way. See the real truth in what we see and hear what is really being said and written.
One should also keep in mind that in our present life, a result of many reincarnations, we all are a gathering of many lives, in each of those we had our believes and were convinced that was taught, was right.
Therefore in our present reincarnation we may have dogma left over which is inhereted from our past lives and influence our objective vision today.
But another great gift were the words Jesus spoke in mentioning that we all are Sons and Daughters of God and that the things He did, we all will do and even more !
This means that each and everyone of us will sooner or later reach the Loving level that Jesus has reached, but we will even ‘grow’ further and beyond that of Jesus himself.
One of the very old and painful dogmatic remains of past incarnations is the belief that Jesus had the exclusive right to be the Son of God, although he learned us something else that no one has an exclusive Right and we are all unique and a gift of God and each of Us is beloved in the same manner.
Isn’t that a wonderfull gift ! 🙂
Remember your beloved each second of the day and your Soul is pure since the Beginning of time!
Good Luck to All
Oene
Let me start with I am Christian. And above all I Believe in the Bible as the word of God. But I am still learning about the word of God it never stops. ( the beauty of being a mortal.) I believe that you reach a level of true knowledge here on earth. People that say the Bible contradicts are the same people who do not read it. Once you accept Jesus as your savior you are able to go to heaven, and stop coming back to this realm on earth which many go through hell. It’s a learning process in reality what does the bible teach? The answer is find your creator through a relationship he speaks if you listen, teaches the right way and the mistakes of the past. The Bible speaks of prophecy, dreams, visions that only those who seek shall find. Jesus did nothing wrong yet we still do not believe.
God bless,
Claudia
Claudia, your point is well taken. Many blessings!
Intriguing discussion here; however, I disagree entirely. The Bible does NOT teach reincarnation. “Reap what you sow” is NOT karma. It is my opinion that you are attempting to blend errant ideologies with Christianity and you’re essentially being dishonest here.
The literal definition of karma is “the sum of a person’s actions in this and PREVIOUS STATES OF EXISTENCE, viewed as deciding their fate in future existences.” THAT is NOT the principle of reaping and sowing that Scripture presents. In fact, you have to employ a fair amount of manipulation to come up with such a notion.
Reaping and sowing simply refers to the logic that whatever you plant, a harvest will come of that. If I invest money in the bank, I will reap a harvest of interest. If I do good to others, others may be inclined to return good unto me (or God may even bestow blessings)… but there are plenty of examples in Scripture where Believers in Christ showed love and performed good deeds and yet were returned evil from the world. There is no evidence that God returned blessing or judgment on a person for THEIR actions IN A PREVIOUS LIFE or that they will be reincarnated for the purpose of future spiritual growth or reward. Your principle breaks down in these areas because it (the principle of reaping and sowing) has nothing to do with previous lives and Buddhist or Hindu ideology, which is essentially what you’re dealing with here. Though there may be elements of the notion (i.e. with respect to reaping what you sow – which some loosely refer to as “karma”), you take this too far and propose a deceptive, unbiblical conclusion.
For your information, GRACE trumps karma anyway! Grace says you get what you DON’T deserve because of Christ’s righteousness! It utterly upsets the whole idea of karma. By accepting karma, you must reject the Gospel, which asserts that Christ sacrifice on the Cross was sufficient ONCE and for ALL and that those who believe this Gospel become the recipients of its blessings.
So much of this I’m reading here on your site is essentially high-sounding nonsense (mixed in with a little truth). It comes off as “enlightened” but is clearly manipulated teaching, which results in deception. For the record, there really are no “hidden” meanings of the Bible (as your site title suggests). The Scripture itself says that God’s written Word is a LIGHT unto our path and a LAMP unto our feet and Christ himself is the Light of the World; exposing darkness and opening the only way to the Father, which is through Him. We may lack understanding in areas as it applies to our level of maturity or sometimes ignorance of the truth (or resistance of the truth), but that doesn’t mean the truths of Scripture are hidden. Paul’s letter to the Corinthians was to expose such gnostic errors to those that were being led astray by such teachings. John also dealt with this sect/ideology in his time (the book of 1 John obviously evidences this).
The Scripture teaches that God gives wisdom lavishly to ALL who ask (James 1:5). It’s not a secret and it’s not withheld so that only the super intellectual elite and “deep” have access to it. Jesus never taught any such nonsense. What He taught was that those who listen to His instruction would increase in understanding. It’s not that anything is being hidden anymore than someone who doesn’t pay attention to the beliefs of a political leader may prove to be ignorant of what they teach because they are not listening and investigating what has been said and done. If you want to know, you have to pay attention, but it’s not a secret.
Finally, your closing statement that the soul is pure since the beginning of time is completely unfounded biblically… These are pretty obvious themes of Gnosticism, which inadvertently denies denies the incarnation of God as the Son and therefore the efficacy of the atonement. Christ does not/ did not redeem us by revelation or illumination but by suffering on the Cross; shedding His own blood for our sins and they dying, being buried in the grave, and resurrecting to life. God through Christ took on human flesh and paid the full penalty for sin by standing in our place. No amount of “illumination” can cause you to evolve into a higher state of self-awareness. The self awareness you need is to realize that you are a sinner, stained and corrupt and deserving full of death and hell! There is NOTHING good in you (or me)! Without a Savior, you will not inherit eternal life and you will die in your sin. Please repent. Please turn to God. Please reject these false teachings that produce blindness. God is rich in mercy… but don’t deceive yourselves in thinking your soul is pure.
Romans 3:9-19 – “…for we have already shown that all people, whether Jews or Gentiles, are under the power of sin. As the Scriptures say, ‘No one is righteous—not even one. No one is truly wise; no one is seeking God. All have turned away; all have become useless. No one does good, not a single one.’ ‘Their talk is foul, like the stench from an open grave. Their tongues are filled with lies.’ ‘Snake venom drips from their lips.’ ‘Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.’ ‘They rush to commit murder. Destruction and misery always follow them. They don’t know where to find peace.’ ‘They have no fear of God at all.’ Obviously, the law applies to those to whom it was given, for its purpose is to keep people from having excuses, and to show that the entire world is guilty before God.”
Dave…
While I appreciate the effort you have put in this comment, I also disagree based on scripture. God dwells in the deep darkness, in secret. And scripture makes it clear that only KINGS search out this deeper spiritual revelation. By King, is meant, one who is willing to go beyond the literal interpretation which gives life, as Paul clearly tells us in 2 Cor 3:6. In truth, we could argue scripture all day long, and come up with literary arguments that back up each of what we say. Therefore the argument is a moot point. The real message is this is what do you believe, through faith. There are those who will question man-made doctrine and come up with contradictions which lead them to a higher spiritual truth, and then there are those which will remain in man-made doctrine as the undeniable truth. I do not judge you for either decision, but present here the alternative. In reality, your use of scripture to combat my interpretation really means nothing, because for every scripture you use I can show another scripture to show a contradictory view. And that is a fact. So what do you do now? Do you realize that in the paradox there must be a deeper meaning, if you hold scripture as truth, or do you say, as the atheist, it is meaningless? If you want to hold onto scripture then you must be willing to admit that the literal interpretation doesn’t always add up. There are many examples of reincarnation in the Bible, no matter how many you use to argue against. The truth is these are all intellectual exercises, based on my view or your view. But really what is the depth of it all spiritually?
You said: They conclude that “in the spirit and power of Elijah” means it wasn’t Elijah. This is probably one of the worst arguments an opponent could give. Why? Because returning to the earth in the “spirit and power” of someone who has already lived on the earth IS REINCARNATION!
I couldn’t help but actually, literally laugh out loud when I read this. I’m the type of grand kid to ask my pastoral grandpa about reincarnation. Just to tick him off. Because, let’s face it. He is leading people astray on milk only.
But that’s just it. Those that know the truth (the spiritual “meat”) have to almost hide our beliefs for fear of those on milk, taking our confidence away from us. It’s almost like we KNOW how they are going to react to such an idea, so we aren’t able to save them from themselves.
But, I digress.
I find this topic so liberating and fun to study. Maybe because it’s so controversial and new? Or perhaps because secretly I’m hoping I do get another do over if I didn’t play this hand right.
I have been lifted out of my body by a white light during meditation before. I’ve danced in circles and spoken telepathically with this angel of beautiful love. I firmly believe I have been resurrected. I believe I have been born again. A lot of Christians could tell you they are too, and who knows, maybe they are. But I can tell you that I’ve experienced the love of God. something not a lot of people experience on this plane. I’m so thankful.
God bless!
Reincarnation , yes .
Check out how many times , and where is mentioned the word paradise …
We grow and learn…and mature through experiencing our tribulations each and every day. There is one verse in the bible which only makes sense with the doctrine of reincarnation. If we struggle against God during our lifetimes, we will eventually learn those lessons one way or another.
That verse is in Revelation 3:12….”Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall GO NO MORE OUT: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.”
Each of us may have to “go out” and accomplish what is needed either for ourselves or for others. My own assumption is that this is for our own development in a higher spiritual level, or we voluntarily “go out” again in assisting with the growth of others.
God bless you, Josh.
For 7 billion people on Gaia there are 7 billion different beliefs and opinions about life. Now that’s what I call a smorgasbord of choice. I am a New Ager so reincarnation goes with my bundle as does the new energy after 2012. Whatever your bundle is, God bless you, we are all dearly loved. I don’t really care who put what in the Bible or who took what out of it – it only causes debate and takes the energy away from the real issues of spiritual evolution, namely unconditional love, forgiveness, compassion and non-judgment. But I can’t help adding this – it is beyond all spiritual logic to think we can master spiritual evolution in one life time. Oh for the Bible enthusiasts replace the word God in the OT with the names of extra terrestrial leaders and the OT makes perfect sense. If you want a totally different perspective of what is REALLY going on subscribe to Gaia.com but don’t comment until you have done at least 3 months serious watching under the menu ‘Seeking Truth’
Donny…”Gaia” = Sophia (Wisdom), suggest you endeavor to inquire of the Gnostics. There you will find that ascribing “God” in the OT to “extraterrestrial leaders” is not too far from the truth. Also Josh, consider this…..just because something is TRUE (reincarnation), does not automatically make it a good thing. The early Gnostic Christians ( the only true Christians ) understood the law of karma and reincarnation to be something we needed to be set free from. So Paul says in Romans 8:2….” the law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus has set me free from the law of sin and death” (karma and reincarnation).
I am not going to get into and argument/discussion as to whether reincarnation is fact….I believe in it, and for me, in my personal journey, that is all that matters…… What you BELIEVE is, or will become your personal reality.
My suggestions is to open your mind, research the subject and read the works of the famous authors like
Dr. Ian Stevenson, Dr. Helen Wambach, Dr Brian Weiss, Michael Newton (Phd) and then make up your own mind, because only the can you judge.
Reincarnation is absolutely fact. The problem is, it’s not absolutely good. And if you think you have a choice coming back here again and again, you are mistaken. The universal law of karma dictates that you return, because you somehow have some “debt” to pay that you know nothing of. For example, the law says “You shall not kill”. But the creator made a world (cosmos) where every living thing must kill another living thing, in order to stay alive. In other words, life here depends upon death, in order to be “life”. So what we have here is a realm of FALSE “life”, which is really just death and dying…..perpetually. That’s why the Lord could say things like….” let the dead bury their own dead”. This physical existence we think is life, is in truth DEATH. It’s a rigged game folks, and we cannot win.
The only solution is for us to remember who we really are. To awaken from our sleep and “know” (gnosis) who our true Father is and where our true home is. Because that’s where TRUE LIFE is. Here you see a beautiful flower today, but tomorrow it’s all shriveled up and dying. There that beautiful flower is always fresh and beautiful, forever. So know that you are already perfect, just as your Father is, since you are a part of Him. And when the time comes, tell the creator that his laws don’t apply to you. Give him back his body/soul that he created and imprisoned you in. Then take your Spirit home to the Pleroma, (the eternal realm), to your Father/Mother, where you belong.
No again Josh! Listen, you are trying to be both apart of the world and popular while also trying to love God! But, you don’t know the God you believe in and the real God doesn’t know you and I question if you even like him! Jesus offended people and they killed him! He whipped them and told the powers that be, they are the son of the devil! Who is your father!?
The story of the blind man doesn’t point to the disciples (namely John) believing in reincarnation AT ALL. When they asked if the man was blind because of a sin committed by his parents or himself they were obviously referring to a widely known misconception of the time that if a person’s parents had sinned or if the person sinned then they may be physically punished by God, for example with blindness. They didn’t mean that the man had sinned in a “previous life” but they meant in his current (and only) physical life which our omniscient God would know about and punish him before hand. People back then believed this because they didn’t understand physical deformities or handi-capabilities and thought that it was a punishment from God.
Hi Joshua,
What a wonderful and enlightening piece of writing indeed has come from you! On top of what you have said about reincarnation, I would like to add, the fact that, Christians believe in Jesus who is claimed to be a God of LOVE. Although He was a Jew born into Judaism, He certainly brought this radical message of LOVE to a rather SELFISH theology that surrounded Judaism. Remember the Parable of the ‘GOOD SAMARITAN’?
If ‘LOVE’ is the foundation of the Christian psyche (Mind Set’, how can it be an act of LOVE, if everyone is just given just ONE BIRTH to get it right in order to return to the Kingdom of God?
In fact, the episode where John the Baptist was asked whether he was Elijah, by itself shows that REINCARNATION is true. Why ask about it if the Jews did not believe in it? I quite agree with you on everything you have said.
There is no doubt, that we come here and are born to learn and to mature and be ready to return to our ETERNAL HOME. If we are NOT READY, meaning that we have failed to LOVE and to FORGIVE, we will keep coming back, until we get it right.
Thank you
Jayv Pilai
Thank you for the comment. Agreed that a large part of Jewish and Christian society believed in reincarnation. Justinian had it blotted out of all church teachings, which means it was being taught!
Fascinating article Joshua, thank you! I hold many of the same views as yourself.
Simply fantastic this article that talks about reincarnation, excellent.
Reincarnation is basically man’s way of saying that eventually you will be good enough to receive eternal life. What good would it do to come back to earth as a different or even better version of yourself? The changes in you over several reincarnations would not be enough to make a difference. You would live your first life as a sinner who turned from God, then you would come back as a different person who sins and turns from God. This endless cycle would be of no benefit. Even the reincarnated person will sin and fall short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23), even the reincarnated person will turn from God and go their own way (Isaiah 53:6), even the reincarnated person is not good enough (Psalm 53:3), even the reincarnated person will sin (Ecclesiastes 7:20). Jesus is crucified and raised in us because we are, in and of ourselves, incapable of holiness (even if we were in our tenth or hundredth reincarnated body, we cannot obtain holiness through reincarnation because all men have sinned, even the reincarnated one). Reincarnation takes our eyes off of our Savior, Jesus Christ, who paid the price needed in order for us to have eternal life. I don’t care how many times a person is reincarnated, they will never be made perfect without the finished work of Christ. Men need to take their eyes off of themselves and put their eyes back on our Redeemer and only through Christ can we ever have hope. Reincarnation provides no hope.
Karen…
Thanks for your comment. In reincarnation, you don’t come back as a version of yourself. In fact, the lower personality always dies and is no more. Solomon speaks to this, and many more scriptures.
In the doctrine of reincarnation, man does take his eyes off himself and puts it on Christ for the spiritual seeker.
Furthermore, Karma is the law behind reincarnation, and it is very plainly stated in the Bible. You reap what you sow. There is no more plain definition even in Eastern doctrines. We are not judged at the end of our life only, but by every every thought, action, speech from second to second. Reincarnation is not some Divine plan, it is the automatic expression of consciousness. The narrow path that Christ speaks about, and that the Apostle Paul elaborates on, is the Christ within you, your hope of glory. Until the Christ is birthed, or self-realized within the conscious individual, he cannot know that Christ is already IN the Father and You, your true self, is in Christ.
How can the story of Elijah demonstrate reincarnation, when he was taken up to heaven ALIVE at the end of his life in a flaming chariot? He never died!!! He was then brought back during Christ’s transfiguration, along with Moses. The gospels all describe that event and the disciples Peter, James and John were all present. Then, in a letter Peter wrote to one of the churches later in life, he talks about what happened for them (It’s the Book of First or Second Peter)! It’s also possible that Elijah will show up yet again prior to the Battle of Armageddon. That’s in the book of Revelation where he’ll be one of “the two witnesses” mentioned and all hell breaks loose!
M.J…
The New Testament is symbolism. Jesus said, if you can believe it, Elijah has returned already. So you have to figure out how you wish to interpret it. We can both reason different viewpoints, but the choice is yours. If you’re mind is made up, I do not wish to change it. Blessings.
John the Baptist was born like everyone else. He didn’t appear from thin air, or descend physically from heaven. Likewise, Elijah was a physical human being, given birth to by a woman.
When Christ clearly said John is Elijah, we have to accept this as proof that someone was born on earth who lived previously on earth. There is no other interpretation possible.
It may have been an exceptional case, but, since Christ’s every word is the truth, we must accept it as true.
Christ’s comment about the man born blind (as a result of acts committed “before he was born” suggests Elijah’s rebirth was not unique.
Read John 12:40 to understand what blindness is scripturally. And John 3:4 is a good place to start to find out how a man is “born.”
Hi Karen. Actually, I wasn’t talking about people being born or reborn in spirit. I meant normal, natural, physical birth. I repeat, John the Baptist was a real, physical person, with a body of flesh that was born physically. So was Elijah. There is nothing in scripture that says otherwise.
So if Christ said that Elijah and John were the same person, that means Elijah was reborn. There is really no other interpretation without saying Christ lied, or without going into the sin of adding to or detracting from scripture with mental acrobatics. As I said, you can see this as a rare phenomenon, and still reject the idea that everyone incarnates, but you have to admit that it happened at least once. All things are possible to God, even virgin birth.
But in the passage about the man born blind, Christ says he was born blind due to sin committed before his current birth (ie in a previous existence). That’s the point. Not whether the sin cause physical or spiritual blindness. The kind of blind is irrelevant to the fact that Christ said someone committed sins in a previous life.
Galatians 2:20 is what I believe.
Most Biblical scholars do not consider Galatians to have been written by Paul, but by some anonymous scribe. Its inclusion in the Bible was a decision made by priests, not by God.
In any case, Paul was a mass murderer, and self-admitted persecutor of Christians, who, even after his ‘conversion’ continued to attack the friends of Jesus, and tried to take control of the church established in Jerusalem. John, the leader of the Jerusalem church, had been personally selected by Christ Himself. Paul came to Jerusalem, argued with John and threw him down a flight of stairs. He was an aggressive, evil person who pretended to be a saint, like many of the TV evangelists of today. You should believe in Christ, not in Paul.
That’s correct. Paul was a false apostle and an apostate from the Law.
I completely disagree.
That was a rude comment. I believe scripture, ALL of it. To suggest I don’t believe in Christ is ridiculous. You have an odd way of thinking. Your thinking is based on assumptions and not facts.
The Book of Revelation predicted that many so-called Christians will call out “Christ, Christ” in the time of the Apocalypse, and He won’t acknowledge them, because they have been deceived by false teachers. Was it rude of God to have written that, or loving? Is it not true? Those who spread the teaching of false prophets, such as the mass murderer and persecuter of Christians, Paul, are not followers of Christ. The Bible is not being rude, it is lovingly warning people for their own benefit. If you chose to see the truth as rudeness, there is not much more I can say.
Many great Christians, such as Leo Tolstoy have recognised that Paul was a negative influence. Paul is the false teacher identified in the Essene texts. Read them, they are part of Scripture. Please do not spread the teachings of false prophets. Spread the words of Christ only, otherwise you are a Paulian not a Christian.
And yet here you are persecuting followers of Christ. Hmmm……….
And yet you are disobeying your own false teacher.
Paul wrote:
“Let a woman learn in silence in all submissiveness. I permit no woman to teach or have authority over men; she is to keep silent.”
I’m not the one trying to shut women up.
Hi Marybeth…
Thanks for engaging on this subject as well. If I may add something else for us to consider…
If the Bible were indeed literal in most places, then many groups would have the right to say that Paul was a false teacher because he directly contradicts the literal interpretations of both Christ and the Old Testament law in many places. So you would be correct. But I do not believe this is the case, and it took me quite a bit of time and study many years ago to see why…
There is even a scripture where the Apostle Peter stated that Paul’s “words are hard to understand.” This is because the writer understood that like the rest of scripture, Paul was speaking in parable and allegory, as he states in Galatians 4:24, and as he also understood Christ to be in the Old Testament, such as in the cloud and rock that followed the Israelites. These symbols are speaking to different aspects of the mind. Peter understood that many twisted Paul’s words because they didn’t understand his symbolism, such as when Paul states when speaking about a man and woman that he is not speaking literally, but as the the “mystery of Christ and the Church.”
Paul was an initiate of the mystery schools and understood the different aspects of man’s soul and body. He represents that aspect of us that builds the bridge between the higher and lower minds. “I travail in birth until CHRIST BE FORMED IN YOU.”
This comes about first as we think we are correct in our religious understanding and persecute everything that doesn’t align with our “religious” thinking. But then as we have our Damascus road transformation and personal experience, the mind is changed and we realize that what we once thought we knew was a very limited view indeed. Paul’s words are very hard to understand, but only when we do not understand his symbolism in the allegorical viewpoints he is making.
One other thing that might help is to realize that Paul’s epistles were written way before any of the Gospels. All secular and Biblical scholars agree on this. But most don’t know this because his epistles come after the Gospels in our New Testament, but this skews many things. For example, Paul never mentions a virgin birth or any of Christ’s miracles. Why? Because he didn’t even know those stories! His Christ was the Christ WITHIN. The only historical connect that we read in Paul’s epistles is to his connection with the SON OF DAVID. But David could not build the temple (church, higher mind) because he was a man of war that had to defeat the giants in the land (the mind) so that the way was prepared for his son Solomon (wisdom) to build the temple (higher mind). Jesus also shows us this by chasing the money-changers out of the temple with a warrior like attitude just as King David was a warrior. We must all go through this process.
I hope that may help. Blessings,
Josh
Yes indeed, Malcolm, I find is strange that more Christians are not aware of this. Several biblical scholars such as Robert Eisenman, believe that there is good evidence to suggest that Saul/Paul was the “man of lying” (deceiver) mentioned in the Dead Sea Scrolls, who, along with the High Priest of Jerusalem (the Wicked Priest) was an adversary of the authentic Christians in the Holy City, who had known Christ and walked with him. Paul was a Herodian Jew who continued to support this corrupt, imperialist faction, even after his supposed conversion to Christianity. The evidence for this are letters
he sent to the Herodians. Herod is often described as a manifestation of the Anti-Christ, due to his ordering of the massacre of the innocents. Paul began by helping to murder and persecute Christians, but later realised that a more effective way of attacking Christ was to subvert His teachings from within, through deceit.
Peter, I understand these views of Paul. I dug deep into all of them. My final realization though is that they are reading Paul’s words literal instead of allegorical, and therefore as Peter states, his words are hard to understand and many misinterpret them. Paul was writing in code. I do agree that if he were writing literally it would contradict so much, but this is not really the case.
Thanks, Josh
Hi Josh
Thanks for replying, and for your wonderful site. What woke me up to the fact that Christianity today is really Paulism, was my attending four funerals at different churches, each service with five or more readings. ALL of them were from Paul, and not a single one from Jesus Christ. I realise Christ did not write anything, but we have many of His words through the writers of the gospels.
As another commenter said, much of Paul’s letters are very unlikely to have been written by him, and much of it is fairly innocuous.
But the central lie is hidden within much fluffy talk of love. Christ’s message is that we should BECOME, Paul taught the lie that we only need to BELIEVE and we are saved, no matter how immoral we are. No need to change our ways. It may seem to be a mincing of words, but the difference is enormous. It was a fundamental perversion of Christ’s message.
Peter…
Thanks for the kind words about SOS.
Definitely agree with you that modern Christianity is literal Paulism. A very pertinent observation, actually. But literal Paulism is the issue, not the writer of Paul. Yes, only 7 of Paul’s epistles are considered authentic. But as mystics we realize that the real issue isn’t so much as what’s authentic to a literal historical writer named “Paul,” but to the era which wrote in parables and allegorical and carries the weight of those themes in an esoteric understanding. It is very clear that the same write of the original Pauline 7 epistles were not the same writer as Hebrews, but in symbolism and alleogry they are identical, which is why later writers could put credit under the same name. To the literal mind this is a very strange thing, but in the bigger picture it is not.
Of course this is only my opinion, and we will never know by fact. And this I humbly admit. But that being said, there is an inner knowing which I can only be hinted at through intellectual study. To each his own.
Blessings, Josh
M J……
John 3:13 tells us that nobody has gone to heaven except the One Who came down from heaven, and that is Yahshua.
Elijah, like Stephen, was translated (transported) to another place for specific reasons. Later, Elijah wrote a letter about Jehoram in 2 Chronicles 21:12-15 which proved he was alive and well on this earth and not “in heaven” as is wrongly taught.
Also, Enoch was “translated” (transported) to another place for his safety, but he was not taken to heaven either. Verse 13 states that all those written about DIED.
The scripture about Enoch is fascinating and carries many meanings. He was taken, “for he was not,” can be understood esoterically by the age to which he symbolically lived. He was taken from earth after 365 years. This is also the length of the solar year in days, 365. Astrologically, this ties in with Christ’s life in the twelves signs of the Zodiac, which takes the sun (the higher self, christ) one solar year to move through. This is also why it is said God’s word is written in the heavens, and man is without excuse, meaning, the Bible is not the word of God, but Christ is the word. It is the living word, because Christ is within us, the temple, which we must make holy. The Bible is simply an inspired roadmap and blueprint of knowledge about the soul. In my opinion one of religions biggest mistakes is to believe that the words on a page is God’s word, when the New Testament clearly teaches it is Christ that is the WORD.
Enoch symbolizes, as Christ, the true individuality and the immortal self, which was not, because it survives the death of the physical, astral and mental body of the lower self.
Just some food for thought.
The real meaning of reincarnation is that another personality is attached to the immortal self in each successive life, so that Christ can become all in all and give everything back to the father when the time is complete, through the raising of the dead (the lower self) into union with the higher self, which could never be accomplished in one lifetime. Again, just some food for thought, or at the very least, to reflect on.
As another person commented, reincarnation was clearly taught by some of the earliest church fathers and was widely believed in Christendom. Thank Justinian the emperor and the church for eradicating that widely held belief. In fact, there is evidence that his wife, Theodora, was perhaps the one that had it eradicated through her choice of certain monks she brought to power. But that’s another topic of discussion.
I also wanted to add one more point so that my comment above about the Bible was not taken the wrong way. Although Christ is the WORD, and not the Bible itself, this must be placed into the proper context. The Zohar states that only the wicked believe the Torah is merely a set of stories. The Zohar is not alluding to the fact that it’s literal, it is alluding to the idea that even though it is a story, it is a story containing profound wisdom and higher truths which are spiritually discerned, and should not be regarded as an insignificant story. The Torah points to the Living WORD also, although through Hebraic wisdom.
Forgot to add in that verse 13 is from Hebrews Chapter.
Matthew 17:9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
Are you sure it wasn’t a VISION they saw?
Karen…
Are we sure that the “they” isn’t symbolic of our inner qualities, and that Jesus’ remark isn’t about the resurrection of our lower self. Jesus uses the term, “Son of Man,” here, which gives us a clue.
I’m on board with you. I believe the entirety of scripture is spiritual and allegoric.
Sounds good, Karen. I figured you made that comment simply to allow others to see a different side, so I expounded in the same vein. Some will run with it, some reject it. Which is okay, because everyone has to go with where they are 🙂
Reincarnation is a doctrine that has always been accepted by many Orthodox Jews. It was widely accepted by Christians until the late 6th century. As a Christian, it’s not really that important to me if reincarnation is true or not. I feel, however, that modern Western societies that grew out of Christendom, suffer from a needless impatience and fear of death, resulting from the idea that there is only one life.
Christ’s answer about the man born blind would have made His followers feel reassured that God does not randomly cause suffering, but that suffering is a consequence of our actions, and is not cancelled by merely losing out material body.
The FOMO (fear of missing out) is much less in societies where there is a belief that the soul can have multiple lives. Free from this paralysing anxiety and hankering for material things, people can be free to focus on God.
Good points.
I would say we should clear the diffrence of reincarnation and rebirth. Reincarnation is a static thing, the same guy which was now is again, which is nonsense and we can proof this with logic. The modern buddhist are in the same way teached nonsense because exactly of that subtle but same time huge diffrence. Rebirth is the real deal and ancient buddhists had it right, because as we know everything is constantly changing and even if we say there is a ground/spark/god essence which is like hardware to software, id doesnt matter because without a world which we can expierience(if there are higher realms its the same) conciousness cant expirience so it always depends on each other, so than we come to the old real buddhist conclusion that in the end subject and object are one(or maybe we can say if its easier that they are always diffrent and together at same time which is a paradoxum but true).
So in the case of elijah or rebirth itself, john once was elijah but since he formed in the birth process as john he was still bit diffrent and this always goes on because than we have the john as child, is diffrent to teen john(in every part of expirience), is diffrent to late role as john the baptist.
In eastern philosphy the soul goes on or the subtle body with his main characteristics, therefore we always appear unique or in some cases as foreign to a whole family in behaviour, but the old concepts and stuff from before is gone and we build them new in the next life.
So for me it is logic and i dont need proof from any book, i think we can see it in the bible also with proper understanding.
There are some that believe that the punishment for our original sin was not only being cast out from Eden. I believe we have been cursed with reincarnation, until we live the life God has chosen for us. Everytime we live a life not according to God’s will, we will die and be sent back to earth, instead of being received into his arms. The latter only being possible, because of christ’s sacrifice for us.
Hi, Joshua. I wrote a post about reincarnation for my blog some time back, but never actually posted it because I let my domain name expire. I thought I would share it here.
In this article I will be discussing a subject that is something of a taboo among Universalists, namely, the possibility that reincarnation figures heavily into God’s plan to eventually save all people who have ever lived. I know this is controversial. I know it poses some scriptural and philosophical problems. The question is: Does it create more problems than it solves or solve more problems than it creates? I am going to try to make the case that the latter is true. Consider: Universalists believe that most people will be saved posthumously, in the next life, probably after some intense refining by God. Presumably, this is to be accomplished in some kind of mysterious netherworld. What is this place? Is it another society? Or a place where people interact one-on-one with God? Or is it hell? All three possibilities seem less plausible to me than reincarnation. I will take them in order.
Another Society: Okay, let’s see how this might work. Mohammad Abad is born into our world here on planet earth. He lives here for eighty years as a Muslim, then dies, unsaved. Off he goes to a different world, where he lives another life, and eventually gets saved. Question is: What’s so different about this world than the one he came from? Is there a single word about it anywhere in the bible? If it’s the place where most of humanity goes to get saved, why not one reference? The whole arrangement seems to render our lives here on earth as pretty pointless, doesn’t it? After all, this other world is where the action’s at; earth is just a pointless pitstop for most. I suppose it’s possible, but it just doesn’t seem very plausible to me. So, let’s look at the next possibility.
A One on One Encounter: Okay, so how might this work? There’s a cosmic interrogation room in another dimension where God is waiting for us with a heat lamp? So Joe Smith dies at six months old, unsaved, and appears before God in the interrogation room for some working over until he’s saved, then gets ushered through the pearly gates? Really? Why didn’t God just save him the first time around? Again, I suppose it is possible, but it just doesn’t seem plausible. Which brings me to the next possibility.
Hell: Okay, this is just the previous thing by another name (hell instead of interrogation room). Doesn’t add anything to the discussion, so let’s not even go there. So let’s consider the last possibility.
Reincarnation: Like I said, I know reincarnation poses some problems, but I happen to believe it solves more than it creates. Let’s take our baby Joe Smith as an example. Remember, he died at just six months. Now, we have seen that none of the three aforementioned scenarios are probable, so how might baby Joe get saved? Well, we can easily see how reincarnation solves the problem. He gets saved in the usual way, by hearing the gospel, and believing with his heart and confessing with his mouth. No absurdities needed!
But, let’s suppose for a moment we reject the reincarnation scenario, and go with one of the other three. It seems to me that not only do the alternate scenarios make less sense; they will also require something almost exactly like reincarnation anyhow. Let me explain. Remember, baby Joe died unsaved, so presumably, he still has some work to do, or have done to him, either in hell or another dimension. So, how exactly is this work to be done to and for someone with the mind and body of an infant? Will he not have to be resurrected and given a form and a mind capable of understanding the gospel?
Let’s take the one-on-one option, for instance, and see how this involves something very close to reincarnation. Are we to believe that baby Joe appears before God for his working over in the form, and with the mind, of an infant? Of course not. He is suited with a much more mature mind and body. But that’s resurrection, you say; not reincarnation! He’s still Joe Smith, not someone else!
But is he? If he has gone from six months old to say 20 years old, then in what meaningful sense can we say he is still Joe Smith? None that I can think of. Truth is, on this model, he hasn’t been reincarnated OR resurrected; he’s not even HIMSELF anymore! So, we’ve managed to avoid having him reincarnated, but at what cost? He’s been lost in the process, just as surely as he would be had he been re-born as another person in another country at another time. But at least in the latter scenario, we do not have to involve him in any of the aforementioned absurdities. He is simply recast in a different form, as it suits the Potter to recast him. What’s the problem with that? Consider: a person dies unsaved. His body decays. His spirit returns to the Lord. Now what? Well, an unsaved person is a marred vessel, is he not? What does God do when an earthen vessel is marred in His hands? Perhaps He simply recasts the person’s spirit into another vessel. “And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hands of the potter, so he made it again into another vessel, as it seemed good to the potter to make.” (Jeremiah 18:3-4)
What I’m saying is this: If you’re going to reject the possibility of reincarnation, can you propose an alternative that doesn’t destroy a person’s prior identity just as completely as reincarnation does in the case of babies and infants? And can you propose a method of post-mortem conversion that doesn’t involve far greater absurdities than the one you are trying to avoid, namely, reincarnation (which isn’t very absurd at all)? If you can, I am all ears.
Hello Joshua,
I just discovered your website and I truly appreciate your posts which give a very good insight in some of the mysteries of the Bible.
I have to say that concerning reincarnation, you have fallen into the trap that you point constantly in all your other posts, which is literal reading of the Bible. You surely do not seem aware of a couple of ideas about reincarnation.
First, the modern idea of reincarnation was spread in Europe by the Thesophists, which detained only a part of the primordial tradition, but were far from knowing the complete Sacred Knowledge.
Secondly when it is said that Elijah has to come again, it is not meant as this “person”. You are mistaken about “what” is coming back. It is meant as an “Entity”. As you could say Adam comes back (unified Entity part of God), or the Archangel Gabriel comes back (Entity: Messenger of God). It is in this sense that it has to be understood that Elijah comes back, or that Abraham lived nine-hundred years (his Entity lived nine hundred years).
You could not find any Great Initiate (of the unified Primordial Tradition from which come all great spiritual lineages and Knowledge transmission chains, and therefore, religions) who would think that reincarnation in flesh exists (true hinduist and buddhist don’t believe it neither). Verily, it is a metaphysical absurdity and therefore can not be true. What is true is the transmigration of the soul after death.
For more information on this subject, I invite you to read René Guénon, a very very High Initiate and Metaphysician. I know of no better author about these subjects that interest you.
Happy to read more from you,
Gabriel
Gabriel…
Thanks for your kind words about the website. It is my pleasure to do so.
I hope my words above weren’t confusing, but I am a little confused about your comment. I am not saying it is the same personality or person which reincarnates. This has been a misunderstanding about the concept of reincarnation. Each successive birth has a new personality attached to the individuality, or the higher mind as the higher mind must manifest as dual. However, there are elements, aggregates, etc. of a former life that are reabsorbed and disseminated again. A new personality is formed with these former aggregates. Does this mean sense?
Blavatsky, the originator of Theosophy, seemed to teach against reincarnation in “Isis Unveiled.” However, she was teaching against the concept of reincarnation in some Eastern traditions that state a soul could manifest on the physical plane as an animal or planet after reaching the human kingdom.
Also,
you say “Finally, I’ll explain what my personal beliefs are on this fascinating subject” which indicates that it is not Knowledge, but only belief.
But the Knowledge of God is not a matter of belief. It is a matter of Knowledge. This Knowledge is called Metaphysics. And there can not be two different theories in Metaphysics, there is only one valid and true Metaphysical theory. It would be as to say that 2+2 can have diferent answers.
As you read or listen to the gospel of Judas, you clearly see that Jesus knows this theory as he teaches Judas Astrology, which is one of the seven sacred ancient sciences which lead to God by studying them.
This is why I believe that it is important to study with teachers who inherited through direct lineage of the Primordial Tradition to be sure we are on the right path!
It is not a matter of Faith anymore, but Wisdom or sacred Science!
Kind regards,
Gabriel